(no subject)

[arliss]

I was sent this in email this morning.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1206-10.htm

While it's scary as shit, it is a sort of relief to have one's paranoia and conspiracy theories confirmed. I want everybody with half a brain to read this and understand how powerful, insidious and relentless these underground and grassroots movements have been in the past 20 years, and how close we are to utter devastation. Go, read. And then come back and tease me about my fetching tinfoil cloche.

Comments

[smonsterbite.livejournal.com]

Terrific speech, and yes, oh-so-scary. I don't even know where to start to combat this madness.

About this?

I read the news just this week and learned how the Environmental Protection Agency had planned to spend nine million dollars - $2 million of it from the administration's friends at the American Chemistry Council - to pay poor families to continue to use pesticides in their homes. These pesticides have been linked to neurological damage in children, but instead of ordering an end to their use, the government and the industry were going to offer the families $970 each, as well as a camcorder and children's clothing, to serve as guinea pigs for the study.

Somebody needs to gently guide Bill to snopes.com.

[fufaraw]

Yeah, it does put a chink in his credibility. You'd think his staff would have caught that.

[cindywrites.livejournal.com]

It's not the only chink. I was rather disappointed in the piece, as I have always sort of liked, admired, and respected Moyers.

He doesn't even seem to have a clue as to the fact that you probably can't find two people in the same pew who agree on the "end times" never mind that LeHaye is currently in a pissing match with his "Left Behind" publisher, because they're publishing a book by another (Christian, Bible believing evangelical/fundie depending on your POV) author, which is written from a post-tribulation POV (that is to say, that its theme where NT Prophecy is concerned, is that most of Revelation has come to pass).

That piece was, imo, not much more than spin, and it was either ill-informed (which I have trouble swallowing, considering it's Moyers, who is no dummy), or it was intentionally misleading people, in the hopes of causing even more prejudice and division.

Moyers ran out of tinfoil on that one, arliss.

[fufaraw]

I'll reiterate what I said elsewhere. I'm just very glad that the agenda--whatever the particulars of whichever faction of the movement, the mere fact that there IS such a movement--is finally reaching the public in more than a conspiracy theorist crackpot way.

I'm afraid, coming from a less-informed on current various Christian beliefs regarding the end times-- and I think Moyers' audience may have had the same handicap--that more specificity regarding any "pissing match with his 'Left Behind' publisher, because they're publishing a book by another (Christian, Bible believing evangelical/fundie depending on your POV" would have confused, diffused, and weakened the presentation.

We don't necessarily want to rumor-monger and go all sky-is-falling. But the religious right has certainly done their share of just that, and by so doing have built the underground movement that is now secure enough in numbers that they are forsaking concealment and coming forward with their agendas.

If we're ever going to be loud and attention-getting, now's the time. And if the opposition has no respect for reality-based information, then I see no reason for us to forsake a cohesive message in order to present each faction's particulars, when the single message is a better vehicle to get our points across.

[cindywrites.livejournal.com]

The thing is, there is no cohesion amongst the religious right on eschatology, even within denominations, so it is a bullshit POV.

Does the right (religious and less so) put forth legislation that respects the earth? No, not so much. And we're earthings (religion aside) and have to live here (and the religious amongst us know or should--that we are to be good stewards of that put in our charge), so that's where our side (and I mean our, I'm a member of the frigging Sierra Club) needs to make our points.

Are there nuts among the religious who think they can wreck the earth to hasten Jesus return? Sure. But mostly, the right is driven by the politics of greed, not the pre-tribulation eschatology.

[fufaraw]

I can wholeheartedly agree with this. And also? I was completely blown away a few years ago by a group of Promise Keeper type Southern Baptist men who had decided that the word "dominion" had been taken too far, and that they, and well, everyone, needed to take the term "stewardship" more seriously. That having dominion did not mean squandering thoughtlessly, and that stewardship meant caring for, nurturing, and keeping healthy.

Really. If Southern Baptists can come to this decision, it gave me hope that even wealthy international industrialists might someday have a thought for their descendants. What's got me atwitter is the idea that nothing after us matters because there won't be any after us--and it's up to them to see to it that their vision of Revelations comes to pass.

I'm really not rational on this subject. I haven't been for quite some time, and I apologise for any crackpotty behavior.

[kibarika.livejournal.com]

I realize this is trite and probably way out of line, but...

At least you have a really CUTE tin-foil hat.

(I skimmed the speech. I am not the envirogirl I once was, but I am thinking more and more of moving towards using organic cleaning products etc, and for me, that's a step forward. This in response to the pesticide thingy.)

[fufaraw]

Nah, I needed the giggle. I tend to go all earnest and solemn, and lightening up is good.

[kibarika.livejournal.com]

I never know with that kind of comment, so I've learned to apologize before I make them.